Fake Huxleys on Reborns

Baby Talk
21

She has three Huxley’s for sale. Two without COA’s and one with a COA. For the reasons I stated above I think they are fakes but could not say for sure with out the proof of purchase, She posted picks of the flange. I have no idea what the fakes look like, if they are neck stamped so a COA would be nice.

From what you and others insinuate, I agree it is probably futile. Dave is not a doll expert by any means and the site is loosely policed by all of us. It is not really going to work out if half the artists on the site believe it is okay to paint and sell fakes and/or think it is to rude to question an artist for doing so. I am not out to hurt anyone but if Dave where to reach out to me and need proof of purchase, I would have no problem providing it. I would be happy to and I am not sure what the big deal is with that. I would think that would be a common understanding if you are signing up on a site that states no knock off’s that you might at some point need to, not sure how else you would prove it if questioned. I agree it is not practical to be constantly digging up receipts but I guess if that’s the case and you are being asked to show proof all the time because you are constantly posting sold out kits with no COA’s ,you might have a prob with buying fakes. I have been on reborns 6mos, left and came back, been on a year and a half now and so far no one has asked me for proof of purchase.

I do think the sculptors are the ones who need to step up. For whatever reason they have yet to organize in any meaningful way. I feel like rebornsdotcom is our last safe refuge from fakes. If the sculptors could at least organize to work with Dave we could keep the site clean and safe. I don’t think many artist will buy fakes if they can’t sell them on one of the most popular selling sites. Could be a win all around but I won’t hold my breath!

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22

OMG!!! I was just talking to hubby about that earlier. My thought was that if Dave would be open to like get 5 ppl together from the reborn community, who are in good standing and maybe have like a decade of something of selling or reborning under their belt, when Dave gets a complaint he could hand it over to the group to investigate. They would have authority to talk with all involved parties and then they could give their finding to Dave for him to act upon. He could say all 5 must agree to take any action or majority rules, etc. However he would want to set that up. And in exchange maybe he could offer some free time or feature credits to them.

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23

Good suggestions. I have mentioned before that a thread with the flange numbers saved and such that could be referenced…

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I have painted for several years now and in fact I painted six Huxley kits. I bought all of mine when the kit first came out. I think if the kit is marked correctly and the right proportions it would be hard to say for sure that it is fake. Huxley had more variation in the vinyl than I usually see even in the first batch of kits. I think we even discussed it here. Two of my Huxley kits were a hard vinyl, two were really soft, and two had hard heads and arms, but soft legs. I just do not know how even experts could figure it out if it is a good copy. A COA is more important than ever, but I have seen some fakes posted with very authentic looking COAs. I heard that LLE was going to use a hologram that could not be copied and then I also heard of a registration number that could be tracked between owners. Did anything like this happen? I have bought only one kit in the last year and that was Pippa so I just am not sure.

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25

Damn, I was extra wordy and thought I deleted that… sorry.

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I think it is just going to be hard, not impossible and we need to be gentle. I don’t have all my COA’s, I have been doing this for a long time, and not even as long as our old-timers, those ladies would never be able to find proof of purchase after 20 years. I know I wouldn’t be able to find my bill of sale from five years ago.

I think there just has to be a better way.

Rather than having a “feeling” and trying to prove it, I think we might need to have an obvious reason, like it really looks like a knock off (Lordy some of them are horrible) or this person is selling a whole lot of babies at a low price, has a reputation for selling knock-offs. Maybe on her social media she is known for this. Another clue would be someone who is new and is shipping from China. I am in no way saying China as a country is a problem or Chinese people are, but the knock offs are coming mostly from manufacturers in China, where many of our kits are poured.

I think Lesser can spot a fake a mile away, she has been on this from the beginning and calling out those companies. Most of us could spot a fake, this one, if it is a fake it is a good one.

If you are a reputable artists and you are looking to belong to this community and be respected I would think you wouldn’t sell knock offs on Reborns. People vibe the way they need and want but…there is only so much we can do.

If the buyer gets a knock-off and outs someone who is up to no-good, she is done for and will never be able to sell again on Reborns, and it will ruin her reputation with collectors and sculptors.

If anyone asked me for proof of purchase, I would ignore them, honestly. Not to be mean but I don’t do safety pictures and extra photos for the same reason. I earned my reputation, I work hard, if I make a mistake I do my best to make it right. I buy from dealers, sculptors, and known artists I respect.

Sorry if I sound like a broken record, I just hope this doesn’t get too weird.

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27

Here is the sellers response I got from Dave:

Wow…this reborning authority :mask: wasn’t kidding …she did have lots to say… a whole lot of wasted time to read, that I will never get back. For your information I could give a rats about a C.O.A, in my reborns that I create, but I am aware that some are very anal about them, so I make certain that I ship babies with them, should they come with one. I personally do not look for a C.OA. if I like /love the look of a kit(baby) I will buy it, regardless of coming with one, simple as that…I look at reborning as a hobby, and I sell the babies in order to fund my hobby(as it is an expensive hobby) I am not a collector, so a C.O.A. doesn’t mean a thing to me, and I am not made of money…so I look for reasonably priced kits that I would love to bring to life, and I love the look of the “Huxley” face, so when I saw the kits on Ebay, I snagged them up. One more thing… should the jury deem my babies to be “FAKE” then I will have no problem removing them from this site, they are deserving of far better treatment, poor little reborned babies :cry: My ignorant eyes have been opened, though…Reborning is not just for fun/enjoyment any longer, its turned into big business, and that always boils down to the all mighty dollar, which inevitably ruins the good in anything, by the by…I think it a little unfair, that I am known to the writer, and she/he is not known to me, if I am accused of something, do I not have the right to be aware of who my accuser is?? One more thing…what about switching the limbs out, and mixing/matching parts of different kits to create your own version,doesn’t that step on the kit creators toes…C.O.A.'s are useless with hybrids, so some people will purchase the doll just on the creation, alone, what about that?? :thinking:

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28

I am not saying the artist is knowingly painting and selling fakes. Sounds like she is just not aware or to concerned about it and that is totally her right. But ignorance does not excuse the fact that she is on a site that forbids fakes and that she agreed to those rules when signing up to sell on it. I hope she will be open to understanding the importance of buying only authentic kits and that is is not fair to other artists on the site that do care and have sold out LE kits in their stash to have to go up against fakes, or for seller to receive a doll made from a fake kit, or for the sculptor who loses out completely.

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29

That infuriates me! She is missing the whole point!!
It’s not about the “almighty dollar”
It’s about preserving the art and supporting the sculptors!

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30

This is where it gets messy.

There has to be a better way.

Assume she has originals, and no COA’s because she bought them from an artist thinning out stash?then who apologizes? Assume she didn’t know, like she said, bought them because they were affordable, then what?

Seeds have been planted.

This stuff has to be carefully thought out.

No one on that site wants knock-offs and Dave is doing his best to keep it safe but we also don’t want to start calling people out unfairly. I have three babies listed without COA’s, I know they are not fakes, I bought them, but what if someone questioned that? I have no idea when I bought them, they are BB so I got them here. Do I have to the time to look that up, even if I could? Would I do it? Nope.

I certainly would be ticked off if someone who didn’t know me, who maybe hasn’t been doing this for long called me out, created doubt.

A lot of drama could be had.

I think Dave meant to deter people from obviously trying to sell knock offs. I don’t think he set up the road block to create policing.

I know what I posted last night, and I think I should have deleted, this needs very careful thought.

I know you are trying to look out for artists and that is awesome (high five) but I think we need to all contemplate how to do this respectfully.

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31

Well I’m all for giving someone the benefit of the doubt, but if those words are straight from her mouth…rather, her hands…then she obviously does not care. It’s wrong. She knowingly will buy a cheap knockoff not giving any thought to the fact that the true artist of that sculpted doll is having to compete with their own item technically.

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32

I thought the same thing about her comment. Someone said the circumference of a knock off head will be slightly smaller than the original because the mold was made from the legitimate kit. Apparently a bit of shrinkage occurs during molding?

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33

I think she is pretty much admitted they could be fakes but she doesn’t care?

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34

I heard this to. I have seen youtube vids of the fake kits compared to the real ones and some are smaller. I also have seen vids of fakes next to real and you would never know the difference.

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35

I don’t know what to believe, but from one thing she stated” she is doing this only as a hobby, pays for her supplies” I think charging $1,663:30 for one is more than just a hobby! my suspicion is she may not be on the up-up, but I don’t see how this can be proven for sure. The price she paid for the kits seems the best way, but still this is not really proof. She could counter with the original didn’t know what she had, or the seller was very generous with her money and didn’t care if she lost out on a legitimate, honest price. I see no way this can come to a good outcome for those of us who are reasonable, honest individuals. My conclusion is that she is in it for the MONEY and doesn’t care who she hurts. I for one do not want this to become a witch hunt, I could not at this time with the possibility of no real concrete evidence get her removed from Reborns.com. Dam

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I think it is like she said, she is not a collector and therfore just doesn’t care about the COA. At that point why would you pay $120 for a kit if you can get it for $35 and still sell it on the site. Be crazy not to if you thought like her.

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Exactly. Same as buyers out there who will buy a $59 “reborn” from Amazon or Walmart or wherever. Their kid wants a reborn ~ they buy them a reborn, move on, problem solved. A lot of them don’t know or care about the hours, days, weeks, artists put into our work, COA or not. As much as we say reborns are not meant for children, LOTS of them are purchased for children, let’s face it.

This is all just mind boggling. Feels like reborning as we knew it is fast coming to a halt and there’s not much we can do about it. It’s like our entire community is being wiped out by fakes and scammers.

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someone that does not care should go see how they fair on eBay or Etsy or wherever else amongst all the other fakes :woman_shrugging:t3:
I am glad that Dave polices the site the way he does. He’s the only one with a website that I see giving a care about whether the art can continue with all the scam sites out there…
Also, not a witch hunt when a someone goes to him personally to tell him there is a questionable doll…

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39

Yes, and I appreciate Dave’s efforts. BUT with fakes looking more and more real, how are any of us going to be able to tell for sure any more so we can call them out when we see a listing that might be questionable?

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40

I don’t think anyone can 100% know unless you see pictures of the neck and flange and COA doesn’t seem to help anymore since they are copied too…and if they start copying the flange numbers too then I guess we’re crap outta luck.
I think what gives this one away is her whole outlook on the art. That doll can be 100% for all we know.

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